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VIDEO - DUwHF #763 - Peter Auster
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AUDIO - DUwHF #763 - Peter Auster
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Dr. Peter Auster reviewed his dental life 15 years ago and decided he wanted out. He scanned the want ads, couldn’t find an acceptable substitute and decided to rearrange his dental and physical world instead. Slowly, his dental life evolved and his goal is now to help other unhappy, unfulfilled dentists. He was recently named a 2017 “Leader in Continuing Education” by Dentistry Today Magazine. Dr. Auster has lectured from Portland, Maine, to Portland, Oregon and recently in Kingston, Jamaica. In 2016, he completed his second term on the board of directors of the American Academy of Cosmetic Dentistry and is very proud of his selection as the AACD 2015 Humanitarian of the Year and a voted member of their leadership committee. Dr Auster is founder and past-president of the New York Affiliate of the AACD, the Greater New York Academy of Cosmetic Dentistry. Dr. Auster’s series of articles in Dentistry Today is entitled “Conquering a Difficult Case”. His October, 2015 article in "Inside Dentistry", entitled, "Cosmetic Dentistry for Patients with Bulimia“, discusses the role dentists can play in potentially saving the lives of patients with eating disorders in addition to re-vitalizing their smiles. His seminars include “How to be Thrilled in Dentistry (for the first time)? “(summarized in an October, 2015 article in Dental Economics),"Tackling Complicated Cases”and,“100 Cosmetic Products and Pearls”. He recently became a "Dawson Scholar" and received a "Concept of Complete Dentistry Award" from the Dawson Academy. Dr. Auster’s volunteer work includes 9 years of volunteer dentistry in Jamaica; Give Back a Smile; ADA Donated Dental Services, and Smiles for Life in which his office has contributed over $40,000 to children’s charities in the past 3 years. He has received a “Certificate for International Voluntary Service” from the ADA. He has been voted a "Top Dentist in the Hudson Valley by his peers for the last 9 years. Dr. Auster is a graduate of the University Of Pennsylvania School Of Dental Medicine.
www.cosmeticdentistryassociates.com
Howard Farran: It is just a huge honor for me today to be Podcast interviewing Doctor Peter Auster of Cosmetic Dentistry Associates in Pomona, New York. Where is Pomona, New York? Is that a suburb of New York City?
Dr.Peter Auster: It sure is. It's about an hour from the city.
Howard Farran: An hour from the city. Doctor Peter Auster reviewed his dental life 15 years ago and decided he wanted out. He scanned the want ads, couldn't find an acceptable substitute, and decided to rearrange his dental and physical world instead. Slowly his dental life evolved and his goal is now to help other unhappy, unfulfilled dentists. He was recently named a 2017 Leader in Continuing Education by Dentistry Today Magazine. Doctor Auster has lectured from Portland, Maine to Portland, Oregon and recently in Kingston, Jamaica.
In 2016, he completed a second term on the Board of Directors of the American Academy of Cosmetic Dentistry and is very proud of his selection as the AACD 2015 Humanitarian of the Year and devoted member of the Leadership Committee. Doctor Auster is founder, and past president, of the New York affiliate of the AACD, the Greater New York Academy of Cosmetic Dentistry. Doctor Auster's series of articles in Dentistry Today is entitled, Conquering a Difficult Case. His October 2015 article in Inside Dentistry entitled, Cosmetic Dentistry for Patients with Bulimia discusses a role dentists can play in potentially saving the lives of patients with eating disorders, in addition, to revitalizing their smiles.
His summaries include, How to be Thrilled in Dentistry for the First Time, summarized in an October 2015 article in Dental Economics. Tackling Complicated Cases and 100 Cosmetic Products and Pearls. He recently became a Dawson Scholar and received a Concept of Complete Dentistry Award from the Dawson Academy. Doctor Auster's volunteer work includes nine years of volunteer dentistry in Jamaica, Give Back a Smile, ADA donated dental services, and Smiles for Life, which his office has contributed over $40,000 to children's charities in the last three years. He has received a Certificate for International Voluntary Service from the ADA. He's been voted a top dentist in the Hudson Valley by his peers for the last nine years.
Doctor Auster is a graduate of the University of Pennsylvania School of Dental Medicine. It is just a complete, huge honor that you came on the show today. How are you doing buddy?
Dr.Peter Auster: That makes me sound a whole lot better than I really am, but thank you for reading the whole thing.
Howard Farran: No, you are that and a bag of chips. You're also on, did I mention, a Catapult educator.
Dr.Peter Auster: Yes.
Howard Farran: With Lou Graham, who I think ... What I love about Lou Graham, what I love about you is, dentists get burned out. My dad owned restaurants. He owned Sonic Drive Ins and when you see people about to come in and eat a cheeseburger and onion rings and tatter tots, you can't beat the smile off their face. Then I chose dentistry where they're not coming in with a smile on their face. Instead of making cheeseburgers and tatter tots, you started doing root canals, fillings, and crowns for 10, 20, 30, 40 years. Then you started doing it for losing money prices on some of this PPOs and Medicaids. You can get burned out. What percent of the dentists, in America, do you think, do not enjoy going to work?
Dr.Peter Auster: First question I ask in my seminars is, how many of you are thrilled to come to the office every day? Out of 100 typical people, maybe two say, yes.
Howard Farran: Wow. Only two out of 100. How many times do you think you've asked that question?
Dr.Peter Auster: Oh, gosh. I'd say, at least, 30, 40 times over the years.
Howard Farran: Wow. Only 2% are thrilled to go to work.
Dr.Peter Auster: It depends where I ask it though. If I ask it at a Dental Society Meeting, I'll usually get zero. If I ask it at the Dawson Academy, I'll get, maybe, 70% of the people saying, yes.
Howard Farran: That's profound. The people going to a dental state meeting, nobody. But, if they're the ones going for by going to Dawson, Kois, Spear, Pankey, LVI. If they're going for somewhere, then it's 70%.
Dr.Peter Auster: They need to find a passion. I call it looking for a genius. The genius can be Kois, it can be Spear, it can be you, but they need somebody to help round their life out because dental school just doesn't teach you enough.
Howard Farran: Is that your passion when you're out there lecturing? Is that what gets you in lecturing? Because you were burned out, you said, after 15 years you wanted out. Now, were you thrilled to go to work?
Dr.Peter Auster: Yes I am. I'm actually the happiest that I've ever been in dentistry at a stage where most of my friends are thinking about retirement. I want to keep going.
Howard Farran: Can I ask how old you are?
Dr.Peter Auster: I am 62.
Howard Farran: Well, you're looking damn good buddy. Are you just going to do the, at 65 I retire, or not?
Dr.Peter Auster: I hope, as long as my body will hold out, I want to go for, at least, another 10 years, if it does. But, that's one of the issues we have.
Howard Farran: That's the same thing I always said when I was a Chippendale Dancer. I said, "Until the pole starts bending, I'm not going to quit." But, then, when the pole snapped in half, I had to walk off the stage.
Dr.Peter Auster: You haven't gone back?
Howard Farran: No, I haven't. It's the same question we answer when dental students get on Dental Town. They say, "Do you think I should specialize in pediatric dentistry?" Every old dentist will say, "You should specialize in pediatric dentistry, if that's your passion." Don't do it for supply, demand, economics, follow your passion.
Dr.Peter Auster: Exactly.
Howard Farran: Because they don't realize, if they hated pediatric dentistry and went into because they thought they'd make more money, after five years they'd probably be on heroin, and crack cocaine, and antidepressants, and quit.
Dr.Peter Auster: I start my seminars giving them a list of things that could potentially become their passions. That could be anything from sleep dentistry, from placing implants, from creating your own cases in any way, but you have to find something that means something to you, or else, it's not going to work. The first thing that I do is, I give a list of things, and ask them things, that drive them crazy about dentistry. There are a lot of things that do.
Howard Farran: Are you going to list some of those?
Dr.Peter Auster: If you'd like me too? These all come from the responses that people have given me. Number one, running your own business and a dental practice is a difficult concept because you're working on patients all day long and you've got to do all kinds of other stuff when the day ends. If you're working for owners in dentistry, you've got to deal with the owners. Doing dentistry all day, and paperwork, and calls, and emails, and everything else, dealing with insurance. I call them full moon patients, that we deal with. I think we deal with full moon people than anybody out there. If you take a look at your patient load on a full moon, it's amazing, because it always seems to be the same people.
Howard Farran: Do you really think there's something to that full moon thing?
Dr.Peter Auster: There's no question about it Howie, no question about it. Right now, it is corporate competition that we're dealing with, or being in the corporate structure. Staffing is always a problem, or can be a problem if you don't have the right staff. I give people tips on how to develop the right staff.
One thing about dentistry that's difficult is boredom. Once you start doing it, 20 years of the same thing, it gets really boring filling cavities every day. Dentistry is wear and tear on our bodies. I mentioned before, and so many of my friends have hip problems, back problems, shoulder problems, every thing else. Then there is a simple thing that nobody talks about and that's that our spouses don't understand what we do in the course of a day. They don't necessarily understand that we are doing physical labor. It's not massive physical labor, but we're working with our hands. We're hurting our backs. We're doing everything else. We come home at the end of the day. They want to go and do stuff. We want to relax because we've been working all day long with our hands.
Howard Farran: I know it. I've been a proud sponsor of divorce for years. I love it. Living in my own home, but we won't go there. You just said, get divorced, fire your spouse, or if your single or engaged, don't do it.
Dr.Peter Auster: I went 35 years with the same spouse.
Howard Farran: Wow.
Dr.Peter Auster: It's worked for me, but there has to be some understanding along the way and my wife is an understanding person.
Howard Farran: Yeah, and they've got to get involved with the business because divorce, it's a third over money, a third over sex, and a third over substance abuse. A lot of the substance abuse is back to the money. The dentist comes home and says, "I did five crowns today." The wife hears, aren't crowns $1,000 a piece? Wow, we've got $5,000, let's go shopping. She doesn't know there's $1,000 to adjusted production to the PPO fee of $600, blah, blah, blah. They don't realize he might not be making money. If you have a spouse, they, at least, have to know the accounting.
Dr.Peter Auster: Totally. When I speak, the first part of what I have to say is a downer. Then, I start going in the other direction and try to start trying to build people up. That's stage two.
Howard Farran: Before we go to stage two, you've been in this game for 35 years. I've been in it for 30 years. What's your prediction of where it's going to be in 35 more years? If you were just at the halftime of this, then this NFL football game, do think 35 more years, do you think, we'll all be Walgreens and CVS? Do you think, where do you think it's going?
Dr.Peter Auster: I think you've got to become a boutique in one way or another, or you've got to just sign on and realize you're going to be taken over by the rest. What I mean by a boutique is, you have to be special at something. Whether that's cosmetic dentistry, or implants, or endo or perio, because I think a lot of that is going to become part of the G-P lifestyle. I think you're in trouble. I think small practices, like ours, early on are not going to be around.
Howard Farran: Wow.
Dr.Peter Auster: I'll tell you a little story. Of course, I've got to be very nebulous about this, but a staff member of mine, who worked as a temp for a while, told me a story about a practice that's close to me. Told me that, among the things they do in this practice is, they use one composite material. I'm sure you're familiar with SureFil SDR flow, right?
Howard Farran: Right.
Dr.Peter Auster: It's a base. It's a base that you put underneath another material. It's not a material to be used as a restoration material. In this guy's series of practices, I believe he's got 10 to 12 of them now. That is the only composite they use. They use it for build-ups, for fillings, for composite, whatever. They do it because they get a very, very low price on it. I think he gets it from abroad, so he gets it cheaper on the gray market. That's all he uses. That's number one.
Number two is that he was cited, by an employee, for making his staff members re-wear gloves in the course of the day. They'd wash their gloves and then use them again for the next patient. Now, those things, that's a bad practices have been going like that for years, except for one thing. This guy is coming in line to be one of the head's of one of the major dental societies in the United States.
Howard Farran: And his name is?
Dr.Peter Auster: I can't.
Howard Farran: Come one, it's Dentistry Uncensored. I've been pissing people off my whole life.
Dr.Peter Auster: I can't go on that one.
Howard Farran: But, then you say, it's going to go where we're all going corporate. But, when you and I got out of school, the United Kingdom already was. They had 20,000 dentists. They were all on NHS. We saw the same thing, where the fees got so low, the materials, everything got so shitty, finally dentists just got to the point where, I hate it, and they just started walking. Now, there's 5,000 of those 20,000 U.K. dentists that don't have a thing to do with it and the rest of them are just some kind of a hybrid. When I talk to the hybrid ones, a lot of the hybrid ones, don't want to give up their NHS volume practice because they're pulling, maybe, five or 10 Invisalign cases out a fee for service a month, or five to 10 implant cases. They like the bait and switch like, we'll come in and do all the cleanings and filling for a breakeven or a loss because we think we'll upgrade 10 implants and 10 Invisalign a month. You know what I mean?
The pendulum is always swinging. But anyway, but continue.
Dr.Peter Auster: Part of it is financial, as you know, for kids going out of school. They're coming out of school with $400,000 in debt. They're forced to join these practices because they can't afford to move into any other kind of practice.
Howard Farran: I don't know. Because I see two types of graduates that come out $400,000 in debt. One will just play the violin, I've got $400,000 in debt and then you see them two or three years later at the local meeting and they're all excited because they just bought a $400,000 house. Then, the $400,000 was cry me a river, until the $400,000 was a new house in Chandler.
Then, there's the other breed. Where they're $400,000 in debt and the next time you see them, they just bought a dental office for 750 and if the banks approve you, they don't even have the .4% failure rate. In fact, right now, what we're seeing across the country, it's a seller's market. Almost every practice transition consultant tells me, that whenever you put a practice up, you get four bids the first day. Some of the bids are higher than the offer.
Dr.Peter Auster: That hasn't been the experience with my friends. I guess it depends on different parts of the country and the economy in that part of the country, but I know a number of people, particularly specialists, who haven't been able to sell their practices at all. They just dissolved them.
Howard Farran: Wow. It is a huge country and I don't like the term United States of America because no one refers to Europe as the EU. No one compares Germany to Greece, or Italy to Denmark. No one says the EU doesn't even make any sense. You can't compare Texas, Louisiana, Oklahoma, when a barrel of oil is 100 bucks, to San Francisco's Silicon Valley. It is, even the Federal Reserve says, "It's nine to 12 countries, flying under one flag." You're absolutely right and that's why you say, that you lecture from Portland, Oregon to Portland, Maine.
You're saying, if they're burned out. They're not thrilled to go to work. What if they're going to their associate and 12% of the associates are with the corporate dentistry and the rest are with just private practice. They don't like working for the old man, but they're scared of starting their own business. What would you tell them?
Dr.Peter Auster: I would tell them to get more knowledge before you start doing it. Again, I'd say, find something that you think you can do better than anybody else around you. As I said, it could be implants, it could be Serac, it could be anything that you feel comfortable doing, but you've got to feel comfortable doing it and have the knowledge to do it.
Howard Farran: People always misunderstand my views on these high-tech things. The fact that, if buying a laser or a Serac machine, or a CBCT, just lights your candle. You can't afford not to get it.
Dr.Peter Auster: Right.
Howard Farran: But, if you think you have to have that so that you can have $1 million practice and take home 350, you're out of your mind.
Dr.Peter Auster: Right.
Howard Farran: But, I don't want you to have the $1 million practice, then burn out, then quit. There's boys and their toys to give you passion and purpose. Then there's just straight out business. You can find them. Almost every $1 million practice I know where the doc takes home 350, they're rural, it's all hygiene. They just do fillings and crowns. They don't play [Simplance 00:16:38]. They don't do sleep apnea. They don't do Invisalign. They don't do anything.
Let's talk about those two Americas. It's so easy to crush it in rural, where there's half the competition. It's so brutal in downtown Boston, Manhattan, L.A., Chicago. What would you say to the kids? What would you say to the dentists in those areas that decided they were going to go to Scottsdale?
Dr.Peter Auster: Same thing, same thing. I truly believe that, I guess, maybe it works in a rural setting that I don't know about, what you're talking about, but it's not what I've found touring the country and the places that I've been to. I would say, no matter where you are, just make yourself a highlight in that area, in whatever way you can. That can be ... It doesn't even have to be regular dentistry. It can be in sleep apnea. You could be the guy in your area that really understands how to fix people's snoring issues and their disease issues. Placing of implants, short-term ortho, there's things you can do there that other people can't do. If you can cure people's headaches or migraines, that's something that really makes a difference.
The other thing that I recommend to try to bring people up in their world, which isn't necessarily what you're asking me here, is really get involved with charities. Particularly, doing dentistry either abroad or major charity work in the United States because it really makes a big difference in your life when you do it.
Howard Farran: It does. I remember the first time I did it, I was just a kid. I think I was 27 and I just thought I was so stressed. I thought I was juggling all these balls and I was having a pity party. Next thing I know, I was with 5,000 people that didn't have running water, electricity, or sewage. I saw this on last night, the founder and CEO of Pacific Dental, a Steve Thorne. Have you met Steve?
Dr.Peter Auster: I have not.
Howard Farran: Pacific Dental Services did a deal where they went over there and they put 100 wells in Ethiopia. Did you see that video? Oh my gosh. He's out there in the sticks of Ethiopia. He's filming this stuff. I've been out there. I've been to Tanzania and Somalia and Ethiopia. You go there and you do charity dentistry and you realize, my God, it's like landing on a different planet.
Dr.Peter Auster: I know. My staff tells me when I come back, they want me to go and then come back every couple of weeks because I'm always in this fabulous mood the day I come back. I'm always exhausted. Not the kind of vacation where you feel rested when you come back, but you come back and you just ...
First of all, dentistry is so easy when you've got an overhead light, and you've got a chair, and you got a drill that works, and a suction that actually works. It's amazing how wonderful your equipment is when you come back and try it for the first time.
Howard Farran: You, mostly, when you do missionary dentistry, is it missionary with religion or a church?
Dr.Peter Auster: Neither, neither.
Howard Farran: You call it humanitarian then?
Dr.Peter Auster: Yeah, pretty much. I work with an organization. It's got a really awful name, but it's a great organization. It's called Great Shape International, which was started by-
Howard Farran: Great Shape International?
Dr.Peter Auster: Great Shape International, which initially was started as some other kind of other organization. I don't even remember, but then they got involved with a dentist and suddenly, it's become the largest dental humanitarian organization in the world. They have over 600 people going out every year to Jamaica, St. Lucia, and, I believe, they're going to be starting another country or two. It's amazing stuff. I go with 70 people every year.
Howard Farran: Is it the same 70 people?
Dr.Peter Auster: No. I'd say 50 of them stay the same and then another 20 come in.
Howard Farran: Here is it Great, as in G-R-E-A-T, Shape Inc.
Dr.Peter Auster: Yes.
Howard Farran: Great Shape Inc. Org. Established in 1988. 40,000 people serve annually. 700 volunteers a year. What percent is this dental?
Dr.Peter Auster: I don't know what percentage. I know most of it is dental, but they have an optometry program as well, where they bring glasses to people and educational program. It's great stuff. It really is.
Howard Farran: I've been there when they're removing cataracts for all these poor people who had been blind for years.
Dr.Peter Auster: It's amazing.
Howard Farran: Man, it's just unbelievable. Well that is very cool. Well, you know what you ought to do is, on the message boards, we have 50 categories. We have endo, restorative, crown, we have all these categories, but one of them, I was asking you. One of them we named it humanitarian dentistry. Then we have two sub-categories. One is charitable and one is missionary because some like to do it and spread their religion, other do it, it's all humanitarian. But, this would be under charitable. But, you should go post some pictures and all that stuff under the humanitarian. It will be the best market in the world because it's a very common question where people are in a mid-life crisis saying, "This is on my bucket list. I've always wanted to do it." Now, they're hearing you. Will you do that? Because lots of people are listening right now, then, they're driving. They can't take notes and then they can go to Dental Town and go to the humanitarian. You'll make a post on this?
Dr.Peter Auster: I'd love to. One of the things that I have the opportunity to do that most people don't get to do on these kind of missions is, I do cosmetic dentistry there. I'm not an extractor. I've always hated doing extractions. In Jamaica, where I go, the only real industry is tourism. There's nothing else. It's vacuous in every other way. I have the opportunity to bring these people in, do cosmetic work on them and send them out into the workforce because people can't get jobs in Jamaica, in the tourism industry, if they've got messed up front teeth. It's a fun, really rewarding thing to see. Can I tell you one quick story?
Howard Farran: Of course, you can tell me all the stories you want.
Dr.Peter Auster: This is an awesome story and this made me come back forever. It wasn't even a patient that I saw. It was patient that a buddy of mine, his name is [Richie Lanjulie 00:23:01]. He's one of the real cool guys in dentistry. Anyway, he was sitting next to me and he saw a young woman. The woman was triaged for extracting a wisdom tooth. He was about to extract the wisdom tooth. He took a look at her and saw that she was just 18 years old and had a broken front tooth that was completely shattered, but the triage people there were actually people in, not dentistry from the U.S., but from Jamaica and they thought the most important thing was the abscess to deal with, just ignored this thing in the front.
He asked her if she wanted him to fix it. She started crying hysterically when he said that. He said, "Oh, I'm sorry. I hope I didn't hurt your feelings." She said, "No, no, no. I can't tell you what this means to me." He said, "Well, okay. Why don't you tell me afterwards what the story is. I'd love to hear it."
He did the work. He repaired her front teeth. She took a look in the mirror and started completely weeping after the tooth was extracted again. He asked her why and she said, "That seven years before, when she was 11, she was raped and beaten up." This is now seven years later and every time she ever looked in a mirror, she would see the results of this miserable thing that was done to her. He had this opportunity to change her life in such an amazing way.
When I saw that happen and when I heard about that, I said, "I'm going back every year." I'm going to keep going until my legs and arms keep me.
Howard Farran: That is so cool. That is really cool. You're a big time in the AACD. I went for the first time. I'm lecturing there again this year, but last time I was in Jamaica, I was lecturing at their AACD meeting. That is the most beautiful place in the world, and it's a big shout out to Anissa Holmes. Do you know Anissa Holmes? Delivering the power of WOW. She's a big dentist. Her husband's an oral surgeon. They got a rocking hot practice in Jamaica. Next time you go to Jamaica you've got to look up Anissa.
You also give seminars for Catapult. One of your lectures is Sixty Less Expensive Products that Make Cosmetic Dentistry Easier. You also talked about how you love Dan Fischer's Ultradent Gemini Laser. Why do you love Dan Fischer's Gemini Laser?
Dr.Peter Auster: First of all, it's the coolest looking thing on the face of the Earth. I don't know if you've seen it, but it looks like something ... It's great, it looks like it's right out of Star Wars. It works much better than any diode I've ever used. I've had the chance to work with 10 or 15 diodes over the years. For some reason, I guess it's got to do with the dual-wavelength. It makes a big, big difference in the amount of singing and damage to tissue. I did a case the other day, where I was doing six through 11, and I looked at it afterwards and I restored the ... I actually did composites to restore the teeth right afterwards and I looked at it and it looked like no surgery was ever done. This is two hours later. It's amazing how this machine works. There's something in it that just makes laser use easier and healthier.
Howard Farran: Does Dan Fischer, is he the original manufacturer of that? Does he make that or is someone else the O-E-M, the original equipment manufacturer?
Dr.Peter Auster: The person who designed it, of course, I can't remember his name, was the guy that invented the original Zap Laser. The Zap Laser, later became the NV Laser.
Howard Farran: Now, is that the guy in Salt Lake City?
Dr.Peter Auster: Yes.
Howard Farran: Because the story, because Dan Fischer's in South Jordan, Utah by Salt Lake, but a lot of industry of lasers is all tied to Salt Lake because of the original, smartest guy, in lasers way, way back in the day. He was the brainchild of, basically, lasers for America. When the military wanted, when Reagan wanted SDI. Most of those lasers stuff in America, you can always track back to one instructor back in Salt Lake. I was wondering if that was connected to that guy.
Dr.Peter Auster: I don't know. I just know I love the product.
Howard Farran: Interesting. You recommend ... What would that laser cost? What would a Gemini cost?
Dr.Peter Auster: Oh boy. I believe it's about $6,500. I'll tell you an interesting story about it. I had gotten, I shouldn't name names, so I'm not going to name the name of the other product, but it's one of the big forces in laser. I bought their product that around the same price point. I hated it. I hated it because I could never figure out the exact correct settings for every procedure and they wouldn't help me, at all. They gave me absolutely no help as to what setting to use. They said, "Figure it out for yourself." I would go high on one patient, low on the other and I burned patients. It was really a bad system.
Three months after I bought it, I saw the Gemini for the first time, I think, at the Greater New York. I said to myself, "I've got to get this and I've got to get rid of the other." I sold the other one on Ebay for 5,000 and bought this new one, for I think it was 6,500, at the time.
Howard Farran: Ebay's good. There's also free classified ads on Dental Town. There's about 6,000 ads, current ads, anytime in Dental Town and we're adding that to the Dental Town app. So much of this stuff, that dentists want, I mean, buying a laser or a CAD CAM machine, or CBCT, MRI, CAT scan, anything used. You can find that stuff on Dental Town for half off.
Dr.Peter Auster: That's awesome. One of the products that I talk about as well, is I talk about one of the lights I use for my loops, when I go to Jamaica. Because, in Jamaica, there are no lights. I was going by natural light and there isn't a whole lot of natural light. I hated the lights that I've been using over the years. Just, out of nowhere, I decided to check it out on Amazon. I found a light that cost $33.75. It's an LED light. It's much lighter than anything else on the market and it works absolutely beautifully. You never know what you're going to find what you're going to find.
Howard Farran: Amazing. You're a cosmetic guru, obviously.
Dr.Peter Auster: I'm not a guru.
Howard Farran: No, you are. Your veracity of the most vibrant chapter, I love on your website, Cosmetic Dentistry Associates. You have a YouTube video on there and the YouTube video, that's fantastic. Some of my homies listen to this stuff. When you go to Doctor Auster's website, is it Dentistry of Rockland?
Dr.Peter Auster: It's got several names. You can pick, just call it CosmeticDentistryAssociates.com.
Howard Farran: But, why does it forward to Dentistry of Rockland? Is that for SCO purposes, where you have different names?
Dr.Peter Auster: Correct.
Howard Farran: How many names do you have defaulting into other ones?
Dr.Peter Auster: I think I've got about five other names, but those are the two major ones, are the name of the practice and also the name of the city.
Howard Farran: But, you know, I see four or five, no I probably see 10 dental websites a day because when people send me an email, so many times they'll ask me a question and then they'll just say they're Dave. So, I've got Dave at gmail.1742 and it's a different answer if you're from California or New Zealand. I don't know who the hell you are. But, a lot of times, I on those emails it will be say, Dave@cosmeticdentistryassociates.com, then you can just go there, cut and paste the email off, put a W-W-W in front of the at and see where they're at. 80% of the websites are just lame, just completely lame. It's either one page, or it looks like this might have been all that five or 10 years ago and you bought it at a convention. You haven't done anything to it, but when I see people ... A standard, when you look at your YouTube video, and you start seeing these patients talking about your practice.
Dr.Peter Auster: There they are.
Howard Farran: In fact, it's a YouTube video. Can we hook this on to the end of the Podcast so when they're watching us on Facebook or YouTube they can see it?
Dr.Peter Auster: Of course.
Howard Farran: Can you do that Ryan? Because what happens is, you've got half of America living in the rural. You got half living in the urban, so she's sitting there in some small town in Oklahoma and she thinks, my dentist can't do anything like that. Then they start searching cosmetic dentistry. Then they see something like that, and because of the falling cost of flying, like Southwest Airlines, I know guys in Kansas City that will put videos up, that aren't even as nice as yours, and they'll have people driving two, three hours in from Iowa and Missouri and small towns, especially implants.
In fact, some of the guys who have done Podcasts with me, especially the ones on implants. Several of them said, "Oh my God. I got 10 cases from that just because it was on YouTube." They were searching implant dentistry and found a doctor and they listened to him talk to me on YouTube for an hour and flew three or four states away. I commend you on your marketing, your SCO, your website. Homies, you've got to look at your website. When was the last time you went to your website?
You mentioned the Ultradent Gemini Laser. What are other, less expensive, products that make cosmetic dentistry easier?
Dr.Peter Auster: If you let me backup for one second. I'll tell you how that video came about. Basically, what we do every two years is, we do a photo shoot. We take our patients to a hotel. We take them to this little place called The Pearl River Hilton Hotel. We have a hair person, a makeup person, and we give them some wine and they have a blast at the thing, with a photographer and a videographer. We end the photo shoot by having interviews with them, which is where the interviews came from. Then we have the pictures taken.
About six weeks later, we do what we call the big reveal party. We have the party at my office. It's a wine and cheese party, where we show all the photos that you saw, or some of those that you saw in the video. The patients who are part of the photo shoot, sign the video in gold. We have a red carpet in the office when we do it. Which costs us nothing to do, you can get a red carpet for $11. Patients love it. We invite the patients who have the work done, but we also invite people who've been on the fence about having work done. They get a chance to meet all the people who have all their work done, so that people who had it done can tell them how easy it went and what a great experience it was. It's a real win-win for the office and a win-win for the patients.
Howard Farran: That is very, very cool. You're just hustling. You're out there running for mayor. That's what that is. So many kids sit in the office and wait for the phone to ring, while there's other kids that just go down to the nursing home. They go to the schools. They ask if they can lecture in the schools. They go to the hospitals. They just get out and press the flesh. It seems like any hospital you call, you can come talk about oral health to someone. That is so cool.
Dr.Peter Auster: You asked me about products.
Howard Farran: I want to go back to that laser. One last thing. Now, when someone buys a $6,500 laser, is that because you're an AACD guy and you're doing a lot of re-gingival contouring on anterior cases, or are you also using that instead of packing core, entrenching around inlays, onlays, and crowns?
Dr.Peter Auster: I am just starting to do that, honestly. I've had a laser for 10 years and I'm just starting to do it. I just hate retraction cord. If I can avoid retraction cord, this could be the best thing ever. The other lasers I use, one of the reasons that I switched to this little more sophisticated laser is, I would find that if I was using it for retraction purposes, I would singe and burn the tissue. I find the Gemini doesn't. That's a big, big step, and that's why I'm starting to do it much more often.
Howard Farran: Interesting.
Dr.Peter Auster: But, I'm also using it when I'm doing a class five, when I'm working on an old crown that may have decay underneath it. I'm starting to do fibromas. I'm starting to do frenectomies. It's just such an easy laser to work with that I can do some of the things that were challenges for me in the past.
Howard Farran: Nice. What other less expensive products make cosmetic dentistry easier?
Dr.Peter Auster: These are little things that are very silly, but they work wonderfully. I don't know how familiar you are with Garrison? Which is a tremendous company. Garrison and Triodent are two companies that have been fighting over each other for quite some time. They all make wonderful products. One of the things that Garrison makes is something called the VariStrip, which is a little tiny Mylar strip. A blue Mylar strip, which sounds ridiculous. Why would that be something that's a big deal? Well, they do something with this Mylar strip where it's smaller on one end, larger on the other end and has a natural curve to it. That natural curve, if you put it around the tooth, takes away flash. It's amazing. I use a regular Mylar strip and it always leaves flash at the top, flash at the bottom. When I use these things, I never get it. It's a terrific new product.
Howard Farran: Where is Garrison out of? Because, Triodent, that's New Zealand, isn't it?
Dr.Peter Auster: Triodent is New Zealand, correct. Garrison is someplace in the mid-west, I think, but I couldn't-
Howard Farran: Ohio?
Dr.Peter Auster: I don't know. I don't know.
Howard Farran: What's the name of that blue strip called, Garrison's, what?
Dr.Peter Auster: VariStrip.
Howard Farran: It's spelled-
Dr.Peter Auster: V-A-R-I strip.
Howard Farran: VariStrip, nice. That will reduce flash?
Dr.Peter Auster: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Along with it, they also make some new Matrices that are really wonderful. There's something called a 3D Fusion Matrices, they just came out with, which really work incredibly well at creating good contacts. They just came out with one. I forget what they call it, but it's a much wider matrix. If you've got a tooth were half of the distal end of it is broken off, it actually works on those. Where, in the past, that was the one application where it didn't work. I recommend those a lot. What other?
In terms of composites, I am a huge fan of the Tokuyama products, these days. Omega, which I think is a wonderful cosmetic product for the front of the mouth.
Howard Farran: Spell Tokuyama.
Dr.Peter Auster: I'm sorry.
Howard Farran: You said, Tokuyama?
Dr.Peter Auster: Tokuyama.
Howard Farran: Spell it.
Dr.Peter Auster: T-O-K-Y-A-M-A, yes.
Howard Farran: It's Tokuyama. What's the name of the composite?
Dr.Peter Auster: There are two. They all have the name Estelite. It's Estelite Sigma Quick is their posterior composite, and Estelite Omega is their anterior composite. One of the things I like about both of them, first of all, they polish beautifully. They have an incredible chameleon effect, both of them do, and ambient light does not destroy them. I am really, really impressed by those products.
Howard Farran: Tokuyama Estelite, Sigma is posterior, Omega is in the front?
Dr.Peter Auster: Correct.
Howard Farran: Well, Alpha, Omega, Omega is the end, right? Alpha the beginning, Omega the end. I would think that Alpha would be the incisors. I wonder why they went with Sigma for the back and Omega in the front? Does that make any sense to you?
Dr.Peter Auster: Well, it's no worse than GC. Have you ever seen how GC names products? Genial, G-N.
Howard Farran: That's my point. This company is from Japan, right?
Dr.Peter Auster: Yeah, same thing.
Howard Farran: When you're in MBA school, they always tell you, over and over and over, never do your marketing from your country for another country. I've told this story before when ESPE was a German company before 3M bought it. Remember when they brought over Prompt L-Pop? Like, Prompt L-Pop, what the hell's Prompt L-Pop? The German's like, well prompt is fast and it looked like lollipop, fast lollipop. I'm like, "Okay, Germans you should have gave the job to someone in New York City to answer that." But, some of the Japanese companies.
Dr.Peter Auster: GC makes good products too. They also have something called LinkAce. I remember a couple of years ago when there was a Grandia and a Gradia on the market, at the same time. One with an N, one without an N.
Howard Farran: Right.
Dr.Peter Auster: Other products that I love. I'm a big fan of Ivoclar's product line. Not necessarily the least expensive, but to me, the best in a lot of products. I love their cements these days. Variolink Esthetic is a marvelous cement and it's taken away a lot of the problems I used to have with cosmetic dentistry.
Howard Farran: What I'm doing is, I know my homies are driving so they can't take notes. I am going to ... The Tokuyama Dental Company, you said is ... If you go to my at Howard Farran, these guys are at T-O-K-U-Y, Tokuyama Dental. I'm going to retweet their last tweet. It says, "Come spin the wheel for a chance to win great prizes at a booth," no, it won't read that one. We would like to thank the dental advisors for featuring, at the Toledo Dental Society, go Klinger. I was if Klinger was there. They got a AACD quote, "The American Academy of Cosmetic Dentistry Conference 2017."
Ivoclar, they know that one. Ivoclar, Bob Ganley has been crushing it at Ivoclar for what? How long's he been there?
Dr.Peter Auster: I don't know.
Howard Farran: It's got to be 20 years, isn't it?
Dr.Peter Auster: I think so, but I've got to say that, every product they come out with, there's a good three years of research behind it. They don't just shove things out on the market. One of the things I talk about, in my seminars, again, this something I probably can't say here.
Howard Farran: You can say anything on Dentistry Uncensored.
Dr.Peter Auster: No, I don't want to knock a product.
Howard Farran: Oh, my gosh. We let our guests just go.
Dr.Peter Auster: I bought a scanner a couple of years ago, when they first came out on the market. A very, relatively expensive, scanner by a very, very reliable company, so to speak. I had the product in my office for a year, until finally, they allowed us to return it. They kept on saying there are problems. Yes, yes, we know there are problems. Yeah, yeah. We're changing the software. The new software update will fix it.
Howard Farran: Are you talking about the True Definition from 3M?
Dr.Peter Auster: Hey, as long as you've said it.
Howard Farran: No, Ryan said it. He just whispered in my ear. Thanks, Ryan. Well, they got a really small ad. They got the smallest ad, but they're the only ones you have to use powder. What was it that you didn't like? Was it because you had to use powder?
Dr.Peter Auster: The powder was part of it, but the other part of it was that it would take us 20 minutes to do a scan. It would take us five minutes to take an impression. Which wins?
Howard Farran: Right.
Dr.Peter Auster: I've heard the latest generation of them are better, but this is what I was saying about Ivoclar. It doesn't send things out on the market before it's time and that product was sent out before it's time.
Howard Farran: I notice that, that's the big beauty selling proposition at these dental conventions. What's the one out of Copenhagen? Trios? All their marketing is, I scanned this whole arch in 17 seconds. That seems to be the whole big deal of scanning fast.
Dr.Peter Auster: It's not just the speed, it's also how accurate it works. One thing I definitely recommend is that when you're buying something like that make the rep bring it to the office. Scan a tooth for a crown. Send the crown out. Get the crown back and see how it fits before you buy it.
Howard Farran: Are you scanning your impressions now?
Dr.Peter Auster: Nope. No, not because I don't want to, because I love new stuff. My partner doesn't. My partner was so soured by the experience that it's going to take a long time for her to buy another one.
Howard Farran: It's tough. It has to make sense because look at 3M. I've been using their Impregum for 30 years. For 17 bucks, I can take an Impregum impression and a triple-tray and send it to a lab.
Dr.Peter Auster: Right.
Howard Farran: They want me to buy a $17,000 True Definition Scanner.
Dr.Peter Auster: Right.
Howard Farran: I'm just old school. My boys' grandpa, [Bernard 00:44:40] he still talks about the depression every change he gets. How old is he now? 87. He never got over it. I don't know, but I just think that when you switch from a $17 Impregum to a $17,000 scanner, I got to put this in a full context. Why is this happening? Because you're whining about the $350,000 student loans. You're whining you just bought a practice. That's balance sheet numbers, but in a cashflow deal, I know I'm hearing from the labs. The labs are telling me, that when impressions come in scanned, they're doing a 1% remake. When they're coming in on Impregum impression, vinyl poly sucks, and they're having about a 6% remake. Are you hearing that?
Dr.Peter Auster: It depends, which unit. Some of the units that are fast are not as accurate. That's something you have to look at. That's why I say, "Don't buy it until you've tried it and gotten a crown back."
Howard Farran: You don't have one that you're using or recommend, right now?
Dr.Peter Auster: No. I've heard really good things about the Trios, but no I don't have it myself.
Howard Farran: For the young kids also, when you practice long time you'll realize that there's a bleeding edge. In dentistry, I swear to God, after 30 years. No matter what dentistry comes out with, 1,000 dentists will buy it before they read the first three words.
Dr.Peter Auster: That's true.
Howard Farran: You can sell 1,000 of anything to dentistry.
Dr.Peter Auster: Right.
Howard Farran: But, there's 150,000 dentists who work 32 hours a week, or more. It's the first 1,000 is bleeding edge technology. I like to wait until, at least, 5,000 of my homies have bought it. Because dentists are paralysis, by analysis. They're too damned educated. They don't read fiction. They don't know where the Kardashian's live. They're a hard bunch of people to please. I always say, "If you can please 10,000 dentists with anything. There will be no way to backseat drive their decision." 10,000 dentists who went to eight to 12 years of college, by the time 10,000 dentists have agreed to purchase something, with their own money, it's not longer bleeding edge, it's leading edge. Then the back half of the market, the back 75,000 dentists, they wouldn't buy anything high-tech if you sent it to them free. They would even get out of the box.
Dr.Peter Auster: It's true. We talked about this before. I call them dental society dentists. I'm not knocking that because I was a dental society dentist for my first 10 years or 15 years of practice. But, what I mean by that, are people who only go for continuing education at the local dental society, because the lecturers are cheaper, and to just fulfill what their obligation is for the state, not to really learn anything. That's a big, big difference.
Howard Farran: That's one of the motivators between us starting the online CE on Dental Town. We how have got 411 quarters. That's the impetus behind this Podcast because my 30 years, looking back, the number one variable that just made dentists happy and healthy and crush it and have fun and make lots of money, is that they were all taking about 100 hours of CE a year. When we started doing this show, we thought to ourselves, you're in a small town. Your study club is the last Thursday of every month. You get one hour a month. You get 12 hours a year. We can give you 12 hours in two weeks.
I can get guys like you to come on that would never go to Parsons, Kansas and lecture, because you won't stoop that low.
Dr.Peter Auster: I just lectured in Topeka.
Howard Farran: Topeka. Topeka's three times nicer than Parsons. My God, Topeka is the capital of Kansas. Parsons is where all my grandparents where born.
Dr.Peter Auster: I know that it's [inaudible 00:48:29] for Topeka and it took more than 10, 15 minutes.
Howard Farran: Really? I think you've got to stay hungry, hustle, work out. You've got to be humble, listen to everybody. Listen to teachers. Listen to patients, to staff. You've got to be intellectually curious. If you're not consuming 100 hours a year of your other colleagues talking to you about what they're thinking, then you don't have that curiosity. You're going to learn everything the hard way, or you're going to burn out, or you're going to be miserable. It's guys like you coming on this show for free, that's motivating dentists.
Dr.Peter Auster: Wait, I'm not getting paid for this?
Howard Farran: I'll call Dan Fischer and tell him to send you another laser.
Dr.Peter Auster: Who got me this gig?
Howard Farran: Are you going to play a song on your guitar?
Dr.Peter Auster: It's not my guitar. It's my son's guitar. I'm in his room.
Howard Farran: I love that little dog. He's so cute. He keeps coming in and poking his head around the door, about three times already.
Dr.Peter Auster: [inaudible 00:49:25], she's there somewhere.
Howard Farran: What else? You talked about Ivoclar, Tokuyama, Ultradent Garrison. What else got you excited?
Dr.Peter Auster: What else got me excited products wise?
Howard Farran: About 16 less expensive products that make cosmetic dentistry [crosstalk 00:49:44].
Dr.Peter Auster: I know and I have them all on my list and I have videos of them. How about the T-Scan? Know anything about the T-Scan, which is a product that's been around there for many, many years, made by a company called Tekscan. What it does is it helps you balance bites. If you can balance a bite, potentially, you're not going to break any teeth. You're not going to cause T-M-J problems after you do a case. You'll be able to do diagnose where problems are. That, to me, is a terrific thing.
One of the things that I am very, very strongly in favor of is, old fashioned face bows and old fashioned mounting cases with articulators. The articulators I use are now Whip Mix Articulators and the face bow is the 360, which is very, very fast. One of the things I do, in my lecture, is I tell people who have not been using a face bow in 40 years, since they left dental school. That there's a four-step program in getting them to use it again, because I never touched it for the first 15 years in dentistry and hated the thought of it. But, I find that since I've started using these, and since I've started mounting cases and doing wax ups, and working with a terrific laboratory, life has changed completely for me at the office. I love more what I do because I can create beautiful dentistry that way.
Howard Farran: But, are you talking about for a big anterior case, six, eight, 10, 12 units, or are you talking about for smaller, single units?
Dr.Peter Auster: It depends on how bad the bite is. For a single crown, no, definitely not, but for a case where we're talking five, six units, or more, if the patient is breaking teeth, breaking crowns. If there's a lot of abfraction, if there is other kinds of damage, periodontal damage that doesn't seem to be part of periodontal disease. Obviously, it's occlusally related, absolutely.
Howard Farran: You know what, abfractions, I call this Dentistry Uncensored because I like talking about everything that no one agrees on. I don't what to talk about anything that everyone agrees on. But, when you go back to abfractions, you don't have any really agreement, in the dental industry, about that.
Dr.Peter Auster: Right.
Howard Farran: Some people think it's because they're brushing, they're sawing back and forth. Then, there's the people who come from the veterinary side that say, "Okay, well, how come it's in antelopes, cows, horses and we've never seen them brush, but the sheep have abfractions." What do you think causes an abfraction?
Dr.Peter Auster: I think it is clenching. I think it's banging into one tooth. Why is it usually pre-molars? Why is it usually certain teeth in the mouth and not a whole mouth worth of it? It just doesn't make any sense. If it was just from tooth brushing, we used to tell patients, we already had an answer for that. The answer was, well, if you use a backhand stroke the left side you'd wear down faster. It wasn't really true. I believe that abfraction is caused by clenching, by heavy duty clenching, but I think the areas are worsened once they start by over brushing.
Howard Farran: Well, one of my homies, if you're really passionate about what cause abfractions, I want you to know that if you got to Wikipedia and you go to abfraction it says, "Abfraction is still a controversial theory. There are various ideas on what causes lesions, because of this controversy, the true causes of abfractions also remain disputable. Researchers have proposed that abfractions caused by force on the tooth, from the teeth touching together, includes the force in chewing and swallowing." But, basically, an abfraction is ... Anyway, I also thought that was interesting that, "Abfraction is a form of non-carious tooth tissue lose that occurs along the gingival margin, in other words, abfraction is a mechanical lose of tooth structure that is not caused by tooth decay." But, I find it interesting that, if you go on Wikipedia, right now, it's still says, the official deal ... Because Wikipedia is a pretty damn good source in dentistry. It is.
Dr.Peter Auster: Can be.
Howard Farran: When patients come in and do their 15 minute Google search to trump your little doctor to dentistry paper diploma thing, my patients are going to WebMD, Wikipedia, it's a big deal in dentistry. If you start saying something that Wikipedia or WebMD doesn't agree with ... [inaudible 00:54:26] plan presentation is a huge problem in dentistry. The average of the industry, for just cavities' diagnosis, only a 38% treatment for drill, fill, and bill. 38%, that's one in three.
I want to switch. I only got you for five more minutes.
Dr.Peter Auster: Damn.
Howard Farran: I want you to switch gears completely. We just had 6,000 dentists graduate from dental school and joined our sovereign profession of dentistry. What advice, if you had all 6,000 of them kids in a convention theater, and you had to give them the commencement speech. What would you tell them?
Dr.Peter Auster: Well, I would start with, realize that your education has just started. That you may have learned a fair amount in dental school, but you may understand teeth, do you really understand jaws? Do you understand muscles? Do you understand what causes people to have T-M-J issues as they get older? Do you understand how to deal with a periodontist who has a point of view and an endodontist and orthodontist that have a totally different point of view? I also tell them certain things about what to do to make your practice happy. For example, if you hate doing a procedure, of course, it doesn't necessarily work when you get right out of dental school, but maybe when you're starting your practice.
If you hate doing a procedure, don't do it. Find somebody else to do it for you, refer it out, you'll find ways to fill the schedule. Enjoy the moment, every day. If something good is happening, don't sit and strive for something all the time, because striving, some people never get to where they're striving for, and never enjoy those moments along the way, which is what we were talking about before.
A couple of things. It's very normal to have doubts when you get out of dental school. Very normal to fear that you just don't have it, or you're not as good as the other people out there. Because, frankly, that's how I felt. A friend of yours, probably remembers me that way. That's Howie Goldstein who went to college and dental school with me.
Howard Farran: You guys were in the same graduating class?
Dr.Peter Auster: Yes, sir.
Howard Farran: Well, how come you look so much younger than him?
Dr.Peter Auster: Clean life, I guess.
Howard Farran: I was just teasing Hogo.
Dr.Peter Auster: In actuality, I came out of dental school scared to death. Part of it was that I didn't feel I knew enough. I wish I had gone out to learn more stuff than instead of 15 years later. The other thing. Great hands. How many people truly have great hands in dentistry? That's something. You point to some guy, look how fast he's waxing a tooth when you're in dental school. That's a scary thing when you get out and just don't feel like you have the great hands. Frankly, great hands are not normal. There aren't many of us that can do things the way that a Spear can do it, or the way that a Dawson can do it. It just doesn't work that way. But, you can actually grow to learn how to do things and become better at it than most people out there, if you practice it and if it's something you enjoy to do.
Hiring. Hire people you want to spend your day with. So many people hire people because they pick somebody who has the best review as a dental assistant and, not necessarily the best human being. Well, the human being is who you're spending your time with eight hours a day. You want to be with people that you like and the chances are, if you like them, your patients are going to like them too. It's going to help to grow your practice.
How's that?
Howard Farran: That was awesome, but I'm going to go back with three followup questions because I'm going to try and pin you down. Again, a lot of people think that I'm against buying anything high-tech. Again, that's [inaudible 00:58:12], you don't have to buy anything that's high-tech to make a lot of money. But, you should buy toys that motivate you. The one thing I like about these institutes and I've been to them all. I've been to John Kois. I've seen Frank Spear. I've gone to his institute. Peter Dawson, Bill Dickerson, I went through five weeks of the Pankey Institute, which now, they just hired Lee Ann Brady.
Dr.Peter Auster: I know.
Howard Farran: Woot, woot, woot, woot. She's going to rock it at the Pankey Institute, but the thing I like the most about all those institutes is not all the knowledge about T-M-J and T-M-D and all that. It's that these institutes, they motivate, they inspire, they lead. It's like you wanted to quit the football team and now you go find Vince Lombardi and he just renewed your deal. I saw that with Dawson. I have so many friends that were just aimlessly wandering through dentistry, then they went to Dawson and now, they're just like militant little minions who just love T-M-J.
I don't mean to light your fire, but I want to pin you down. What one would you recommend? Pankey? Dickerson? Bill Dickerson's LVI in Vegas. Pete Dawson's in Tampa. Is he Tampa or St. Petersburg? St. Petersburg.
Dr.Peter Auster: St. Petersburg.
Howard Farran: Frank Spears here in Scottsdale. John Kois is in Seattle. The Pankey Institute is in Key Biscayne. That's outside of Miami. What would you ... If someone was burned out, which we started this discussion, was that after your first 15 years of dentistry, you were done. If someone said, "Well, I've been doing this for 15 years and I'm done. I need to light my fire." Which ones of those institutes would you recommend?
Dr.Peter Auster: Neither. The first thing I would recommend is joining the AACD because once you can create beautiful dentistry, you can also learn at the same point, at the same places, you can learn occlusion. But, the answer to your question is, all three of those institutes are great. They all have their benefits. Spear to me is the best lecturer I have ever heard. Unfortunately, he doesn't lecture all that much anymore. A lot of other people are part of his lectures, but he's the best, most motivating person I've ever listened to. Pete Dawson makes everything incredibly understandable. That goes for his counterparts there, John Cranham. My friend Rajeev Upadya, who's this wonderful guy who's working with them now. At Kois, Kois is a genius. A true genius, with the stuff that comes out of his mouth. All of those places are great. I say go to the place that's closest to you, in your part of the country.
Howard Farran: Yeah, I agree. I agree with everything you've said. Love Frank, love John, love Peter Dawson. Two more quick questions. I know where over. Can I ask you an overtime question?
Dr.Peter Auster: Of course.
Howard Farran: We said, because it's Saturday morning, and I know the bars in your town don't open until five. You've got, at least, another five minutes. You have no excuses. A lot of times, we're back at the graduating class. Every graduating class since the first dental school in Baltimore in 1880, whatever that was. They all graduate and say, "Well, they didn't teach me T-M-J. They didn't teach me Invisalign. We place one implant. We didn't learn sleep apnea. We didn't learn CAD CAM. We only did three canals at endo." They can't learn everything at once. Holding your feet to the fire. I've got $350,000 student loans. I want a return on my investment. Should I learn T-M-J, Invisalign ortho, sleep apnea, surgically placing implants, CAD CAM dentistry, molar endo? Where should she start?
Dr.Peter Auster: Complete dentistry, which is one of those academies you were just talking about. Because, if you don't understand what about this is supposed to work like, you're not going to be able to anything, all the rest of the stuff.
Howard Farran: Explain to her the term. Where that comes from, the term, complete dentistry.
Dr.Peter Auster: I'm not sure if it came from Pankey, but I learned it from Dawson.
Howard Farran: I think it came from Dawson.
Dr.Peter Auster: Basically, it's got to do with learning the teeth, the gums, the joint, and the muscles at the same time and realizing how they interact and not create a round house that's going to break in three months.
Howard Farran: Very last question. I hate to throw you under a bridge, but I'm going to throw you under a bridge and off a building. A lot of them work for corporate, and they have to use this lab. They hate this lab and one of the biggest reasons that associates quit their job is because their working ... When I say, corporate, I shouldn't say corporate because, again, they're only 12% of the dental industry. A lot of people work for old man, some old guy in the middle of Missouri, but his buddy, his drinking buddy for 30 years, is the lab man down the street. You work for me, I pay you 25%, and I pay the lab bill, but I only pay the lab bill if you use my guy for 30 years. He's the best guy in the world. There's a lot of young dentists saying, "But, this is a special case and I'm not using this guy. I don't care if I have to pay for this lab." You know what I mean?
What lab do you recommend?
Dr.Peter Auster: Bay View Dental Laboratory.
Howard Farran: Will you text me that? What is it?
Dr.Peter Auster: Bay View Dental Laboratory.
Howard Farran: B-A-Y-V-I-E-W.
Dr.Peter Auster: Yes.
Howard Farran: I assume that's out of San Francisco?
Dr.Peter Auster: No it's not. No, it's in Virginia Beach. There are two people working there who run the place who are amazing.
Howard Farran: Did you find it?
Dr.Peter Auster: Buddy Shafer and Rick Shafer who've been involved with the Dawson Academy for the last, I don't know, 25 years. They know more about dentistry than 99.99% of dentists out there. They will help you. That's part of what my lecture is about, finding people that actually know more than you do.
Howard Farran: Their website is BVDL.com.
Dr.Peter Auster: That's correct.
Howard Farran: It says, "For over 75 years, and into the third generation, the Shafer family has served the dental industry with commitment, professionalism, and passion. Mister Vernon Shafer began his career in the dental lab field in the 1930s." When Peter Auster and Howard Goldstein were born. They all went to World War II together. He served as the senior dental technician, manager. That's a good one because they get that question a lot. We've had a lot of CEOs of some of these DSMOs on and, I'll tell you what, the better DSMO does not say you have to use one lab, or they have something where I'm paying you 25%, but you've got to use this lab.
At least, make that lab, at least, give them three or four or five choices. Then, you can also, on a bigger case, say your associated joined the AACD and she wants to go this tenured veneer case and she wants to use some lab that's not going to give you a discount, say it's BVDL. You've got to make arrangements because, I don't know, how you're going to build a dental business if 80% of your associates only stay with you for two years, or less. Would you go to a doctor where every two years the doctor was gone and just keep going back to that medical building?
Dr.Peter Auster: I think that maybe changing though. I think the heartlands of the world are going to start to change the way they operate, if they're going to stay in business. But, they've got some benefits, because they can get cheaper supplies and cheaper everything else, and cheaper management styles. But, I think you're right, I think they have to find ways to keep people working for longer periods of time.
Howard Farran: I've been going to this same dermatologist for 30 years. She is so smoking hot. But, anyway. You've got to keep your dentist.
Dr.Peter Auster: Yep, I agree.
Howard Farran: Well, hey, seriously man, it's Saturday morning. I know you're massively hungover. I know Uber had just delivered you back to your house right when we called, but seriously, thank you so much Peter. Will you ever grace Dental Town Magazine with an article?
Dr.Peter Auster: I could work on that if you'd like me to.
Howard Farran: My God, I'm reading your bio. You wrote one for Dentistry Today and Dental Economics and Inside Dentistry. Where's the love for Dental Town?
Dr.Peter Auster: No one's asked me.
Howard Farran: Well, I'm asking right now.
Dr.Peter Auster: Tell Howard to give me a call.
Howard Farran: Tell who?
Dr.Peter Auster: Howard.
Howard Farran: Hogo is in charge of online CE and he would love to have an online CE course. It's crazy. He's in charge of S-word, but the magazine is in charge of, by Tom Giacobbi since the year 2000. It's Hogo at Dental Town. I was Howard at Dental Town. There's already a Howard, so he's Hogo for Howard Goldstein at Dental Town. Tom is just Tom@DentalTown.com. I know Hogo would love to have an online CE course. They're extremely popular and Tom would love to have an article. In fact, I think 60 less expensive products, if you could fit all that. That probably be the whole magazine if you covered 60, but I think that's a hot topic. Whatever you want to talk about.
Dr.Peter Auster: Do I get paid as much as I got paid today?
Howard Farran: Man, we'll give you a free times two.
Dr.Peter Auster: Nice.
Howard Farran: Thank you so much for coming on the show today. I know my homies enjoyed it.
Dr.Peter Auster: Thank you very much.
Howard Farran: Alright. Have a rocking hot day.
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